Aladdin Central Messageboard

[Syera]

Awhile back, some people were complaining because it wasn't exactly clear on my test what kind of questions should qualify for what kind of characters. I've arranged the questions in a new system that I hope will make it clearer.

It's fixed up to be more original-character friendly - yes, you'll be able to test John Sheppard and get (what I hope are) more accurate results.

http://www.springhole.net/quizzes/marysue.htm

What do you think? Any suggestions?
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[dazzeling diamond]

Good test! I think I got lower than 50+, but I guess my character is still a mary sue but still a good test!

[Syera]

You did read the instructions carefully, right? At least one person was getting scores through the roof because he wasn't using the test correctly. After using it properly, his score went down from 49 to 13.
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[dazzeling diamond]

in that case...I better do it again!

[APK]

I have a question. Does making a character really ugly give them potential to be a sue/stu? I mean, if the author keeps referring to this, or if it's used as one of this character's sympathetic "flaws"?

[Calluna]

[Syera]

[Janette Morgan]

[APK]

I actually haven't made any characters for anything yet. I was thinking of tackling it one day (not any time soon) but I wanted to be sure I did my research before making a story.

There is the danger of overdoing anything, even if it's overdoing the character's beauty/ugliness/plainess. How do you keep from making the story blah if you want to make your character an ordinary, average person?

I'm glad that you mentioned that the things listed were symptoms, not the disease, Syera. I've seen authors' characters be accused of being Sues/Stus even though I felt the charcters weren't that at all. And usually the argument is, "They're pretty, well-liked and have good sense of morals!" Yes, these things *could* make a stu/sue but they aren't the only things. And the argument that the main character is the center of the universe could also be good evidence to sueish-ness, but most main charcters are supposed to be the main focus.

All this is very tricky and really confusing, but hopefully I'll get the hang of it because I want to write a good story one day with good characters.

Thanks for creating this test. I've seen other Mary Sue Tests online but this one was the most accurate and helpful.

[Syera]

[Janette Morgan]

Well, see, to my way of thinking, "average" and "ordinary" are not mutually inclusive. It's hard to be "ordinary" and "interesting" -- in fact, the words by nature contradict -- but "average" and "interesting" can be made to work.

The most important thing to remember where character creation is concerned is a simple mantra, "Story Is King". Yep, story plays a lot into your character. It might be said that the characters and story have a symbiotic relationship, and when done properly the story will unfold in such a way that any other person would not have been able to do it. Not in terms of abilities, means or station, but by your character's personality, philosophy and idiosyncracies.

For example, two stories I'm working on at the moment have quite different stories, but very similar lead roles.

Colin (surname unknown) is a blonde teenage boy who enjoys the skateboard and cannot stand Shakespeare. One particularily hot day, he discovers that there is absolutely nothing for him to do, so he caves to the nagging of his parents and does an online job-search. Shortly after that, he falls asleep and, via the high-tech internet system, accidentally swaps his brain with the neural programming of a robot halfway across the planet.

Crane McAlpin is a blonde teenage boy with a fondness for guitar and a general disliking of the ocean. While on vacation on a Caribbean island, he boredly wanders away from a large celebration and is kidnapped by pirates.

On the surface, these two characters (indeed, roles) seem fairly interchangeable, but during the actual writing process Colin and Crane have developed into very different characters, and in fact as I wrote their personalities and opinions into the story I began to realize that one of them wouldn't have allowed himself to fall into the other's situation.

So how do you develop a character like that?

I mentioned earlier that Story is King, but the funny thing about it is that Character is King, too. It's a symbiotic relationship. While you're advancing the plot, you need to include your character's opinion on the situation and the world at large. This can be reflected in your character's thoughts, speech, actions and even your writing style. (I recommend reading some Dave Barry as an example of how someone can view things.) In fact, if the story begins to get slow it can often help to switch focus. "Okay, I'm bored," said Plot. "Character, it's your turn." And while doing this, your character starts - gasp - developing. And, of course, character development is what takes you from "blah" to "interesting".

The reason it's important for your character to fit the plot is for your character consistency. For example, I've been trying to write a story in which I, just as I am, find a device that opens a portal to another world, and follow that portal there. The entire story's been stalled for some time simply because I am much too big of a coward to go through a portal of unknown origin of my own volition.

By the way, if you have an idea of what you want your character to be, do yourself a favor and don't write a character sheet. Don't try to describe your character's personality, likes, dislikes, skills, etc. in minute detail before you start. As your character moves through the story, it will be essential at certain points to reveal certain things, and then you make sure that you only include what you need to.

So, in essence, Plot and Character are two entities which, when created and used in tandem, will serve to keep each other interesting as long as you don't get actual writer's block. Don't worry too hard, and write what you feel. Editing is your friend; once your character develops further, you may wish to go back and alter or even rewrite his or her role. This is probably a more in-depth lecture than you were really after, but hopefully it was helpful somehow.
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[Syera]

Although Janette's advice is good overall, I will say it's a little more suited to original fiction than to fan fiction.

With fan fiction, one must also be careful not to let the fan character become shinier than the canon character, nor let the fan character encroach upon a canon character's territory. (EG, rendering a canon character potentially useless to the plot.)

One thing a fan author should NEVER overlook is considering whether another character would be qualified to fill the spot of the fan character. If the same plot could just as easily be carried out without the fan character, then it's pretty likely that you should drop the character and fill in with canon characters or redesign the character and/or plot so this character is necessary. (No, opening an enchanted door with a magical pendant doesn't count. )

Like Janette said, the story and plot has a symbiotic relationship. This is also true of fan characters. However, if an author isn't careful, he/she may end up with an infective/destructive organism rather than a symbiote.

And yes, Janette is right about Dave Barry. I don't know if you'd enjoy him, but we find that he often provides a unique (and hilarious) perspective on life.
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/living/columnists/dave_barry/
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[APK]

[Syera]

Outlining is fine. What Janette means is do yourself a favor and don't try to come up with everything there is to know about your character beforehand. Just let the character grow alongside the story. Chances're good you can come up with required information on a need-to-know basis.
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[Janette Morgan]