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Who is the main character of "Aladdin"?
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[quote="Jafaria"]Oh no. It couldn't be any earlier than the mid-600s AD. How do I know this? Because they're Muslim. The sphinx thing is a puzzling anachronism, but the fact remains that Agrabah is quite definitely a Muslim city, and the religion started in the 600s. I set it in the 8 or 900s AD myself, seeing as Arabia was having a bit of a golden age in that time period. But yes, that would be the "dark ages" in Europe--before the Crusades, even.[/quote]
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<table border="0" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1" width="100%" class="forumline"> <tr> <th class="thCornerL" width="22%" height="26">Author</th> <th class="thCornerR">Message</th> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Jafaria</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Tue Oct 30, 2007 9:00 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">I don't think the tellers of the original story wanted it to be accurate about China, though, so the whole "wait, why are they acting like Arabs--in China?" thing can be forgiven. I think it was just a way of indicating distance. Like a medieval "Long ago, in a galaxy far far away." Folktales almost always have a vague or a distant location, unless they're legends about real people.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Calluna</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 8:30 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody"></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Emmlei wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">Hey, if I recall correctly, the story of Aladdin is actually set in China, not the Middle East. So it's just one more thing.</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br /><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aladdin#Sources_and_setting" target="_blank" class="postlink">I know you're probably all tired of me linking wikipedia, but this section pretty much sums up my opinion on that subject.</a> They <span style="font-style: italic">say</span> it's in China, but the culture described in the story is a lot more Arabic or Persian than Chinese.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Emmlei</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Sat Oct 27, 2007 7:23 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody"></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Jafaria wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">The 15th Century? The 15th bloody century? Meaning, after the Crusades? After the Turks had already gotten a foothold in the region? You don't GET a city like Agrabah in the 15th century! They need a historical consultant, and if they have one he needs to stop sleeping on the job!</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br />Hey, if I recall correctly, the story of Aladdin is actually set in China, not the Middle East. So it's just one more thing.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Brighteyes</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:31 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody"></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Quote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">I just want to write a fanfic with Haroun al-Rashid in it.</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br /></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Jafaria wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">Okay, the Aladdin characters going to Baghdad and meeting Haroun al-Rashid would be the best thing ever. I can only imagine their reaction upon hearing the name of Haroun's vizier...</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br />If that were a real story, I'd read it. <img src="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif" alt="Very Happy" border="0" /></span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Brighteyes</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Fri Oct 26, 2007 2:25 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">Well, 800-900 AD it is then. <br /> <br /></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>dazzeling diamond wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">But isn't the whole concept of "The Arabian Nights", of which Aladdin is a tale, a pre-Islam idea? Or maybe I'm getting that mixed up with something else <img src="images/smiles/icon_confused.gif" alt="Confused" border="0" /> </td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br /></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Calluna wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">I'd bet that some of the individual stories are. Some of Sindbad's adventures are eerily similar to Odysseus', IIRC...</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br />Well, I remember Wikipedia saying that some of the stories One Thousand And One Nights had Indian, Egyptian, and Mesopotamian roots (among a few others).</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Jafaria</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 7:09 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">The 15th Century? The 15th bloody century? Meaning, after the Crusades? After the Turks had already gotten a foothold in the region? You don't GET a city like Agrabah in the 15th century! They need a historical consultant, and if they have one he needs to stop sleeping on the job! <br /> <br /></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Quote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">I just want to write a fanfic with Haroun al-Rashid in it.</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br />Okay, the Aladdin characters going to Baghdad and meeting Haroun al-Rashid would be the best thing ever. I can only imagine their reaction upon hearing the name of Haroun's vizier...</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>AladdinsGenie</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 6:36 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">*spam whore today* <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /> <br /> <br />So I just watched the special again, and yeah, he heard it at a party. It wasn't in the original text. Galland would attend dinner parties with French noblemen and among the people there was a Syrian priest named Hannah Dahl (Hana Dia? I didn't catch the spelling, but that's what it sounds like <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" />). He would entertain the men by telling versions of Arabic tales. Galland would scribble down those stories at the end of the night and that's where the stories of Aladdin and Ali Baba show up in the over-all Arabian Nights series because he was still translating other texts given to him up until his death.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>AladdinsGenie</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 5:53 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody"></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>Calluna wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">There are no records of the story of Aladdin before 1709, though, unless Wikipedia is lying to me again. <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /> </td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br />It's not. I have a history channel special of the Arabian Nights recorded, and I've done a paper on it. The story of Aladdin wasn't in the original set. That's something Andrew Galland added when he was translating the stories cause he over heard some dude at a party telling them or something. I need to watch the special again <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /></span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>AladdinsGenie</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 5:47 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">Then they're constantly screwing up with the anachronistic items cause fireworks weren't invented until the 1100s, the Unkbut were farming potatoes and that's not in the rest of the world until after the late 1400s/early 1500s, and that guy was still working on the Sphinx when Aladdin and Jasmine fly by and that's around 2500-ish B.C.E. The last one is a joke, I know, but still <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /></span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Calluna</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 5:25 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">On the DVD they said it was set in the 15th century (although I personally don't agree with that; my argument against it is <a href="http://www.aladdincentral.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=71772#71772" target="_blank" class="postlink">here</a>). Personally I agree with what others here have said, that it's probably in the Abbasid Caliphate (around 800s and 900s), since that's when most of the Arabian Nights stories are set. <br /> <br />(I just want to write a fanfic with Haroun al-Rashid in it. Is that so wrong? <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /> ) <br /> <br /></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>dazzeling diamond wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">But isn't the whole concept of "The Arabian Nights", of which Aladdin is a tale, a pre-Islam idea? Or maybe I'm getting that mixed up with something else <img src="images/smiles/icon_confused.gif" alt="Confused" border="0" /> </td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br />I'd bet that some of the individual stories are. Some of Sindbad's adventures are eerily similar to Odysseus', IIRC... <br /> <br />There are no records of the story of Aladdin before 1709, though, unless Wikipedia is lying to me again. <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /> <br /> <br /></span> <table width="90%" cellspacing="1" cellpadding="3" border="0" align="center"> <tr> <td><span class="genmed"><b>dazzeling diamond wrote:</b></span></td> </tr> <tr> <td class="quote">Hmmm, I'm still not sure. I know they mention Allah and Jasmine covers herself when they go out, but it still doesn't seem like it...it just gives off this vibe of ancient history...but that's probably because ancient history is my favourite.</td> </tr> </table> <span class="postbody"> <br /> <br />When I was 10 and first saw Aladdin I thought it was a lot earlier, too, because I knew absolutely nothing about medieval Arabia, but I <span style="font-style: italic">did</span> know a lot about ancient Egypt. The next year when I actually learned something about Islam in Social Studies class I had to do a lot of backpedaling. <img src="images/smiles/icon_lol.gif" alt="Laughing" border="0" /></span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Emmlei</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 5:03 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">According to tvtropes.org, the series pretty much falls into what they term "Arabian Nights Days," which is set between 700-1000AD. So, the above suggestions of around 800-900AD are pretty good guesses. <br /> <br />If you want to know more, check the link: <br /><a href="http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ArabianNightsDays" target="_blank">http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ArabianNightsDays</a></span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Brighteyes</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 9:38 am<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">These are some interesting replies. Much obliged. <img src="images/smiles/icon_biggrin.gif" alt="Very Happy" border="0" /> <br /> <br />@Emmiel: I do recall that episode with Mechanikles and the European sailor (Al Batross, wasn’t it)? I haven’t seen it in such a long time and totally forgot about it. <br /> <br />While I like history myself, I’m actually not very good at remembering specific historical dates, so I admit that I didn’t know that about the sphinx. I guess the animators tossed that in without doing a little research or thought it'd be cute to include it or something? <br /> <br />*checks Wikipedia* Apparently, the Arabian Nights were collected sometime in AD 800-900, so that would place its' creation after the founding of Islam.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>dazzeling diamond</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Thu Oct 25, 2007 1:18 am<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">But isn't the whole concept of "The Arabian Nights", of which Aladdin is a tale, a pre-Islam idea? Or maybe I'm getting that mixed up with something else <img src="images/smiles/icon_confused.gif" alt="Confused" border="0" /> <br /> <br />Hmmm, I'm still not sure. I know they mention Allah and Jasmine covers herself when they go out, but it still doesn't seem like it...it just gives off this vibe of ancient history...but that's probably because ancient history is my favourite.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row2"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>Jafaria</b></span></td> <td class="row2" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 9:19 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">Oh no. It couldn't be any earlier than the mid-600s AD. How do I know this? Because they're Muslim. The sphinx thing is a puzzling anachronism, but the fact remains that Agrabah is quite definitely a Muslim city, and the religion started in the 600s. <br /> <br />I set it in the 8 or 900s AD myself, seeing as Arabia was having a bit of a golden age in that time period. But yes, that would be the "dark ages" in Europe--before the Crusades, even.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> <tr> <td width="22%" align="left" valign="top" class="row1"><span class="name"><a name=""></a><b>dazzeling diamond</b></span></td> <td class="row1" height="28" valign="top"><table width="100%" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <td width="100%"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/icon_minipost.gif" width="12" height="9" alt="Post" title="Post" border="0" /><span class="postdetails">Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 7:33 pm<span class="gen"> </span> Post subject: </span></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><hr /></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2"><span class="postbody">I was thinkin' wayyyy back, like 2500 bc, or whenever it was the sphinx was being built (on account of that dude in egypt during the AWNW sequence) Then again, I haven't really observed any more time references...so I could be way off.</span></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" height="1" class="spaceRow"><img src="templates/subBlack/images/spacer.gif" alt="" width="1" height="1" /></td> </tr> </table>
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